Is google killing Usenet ?

[unknown]

Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.

I suspect that google is causing this ?

[Lew Pitcher]

Post by unknown
Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.
I suspect that google is causing this ?

I'd suspect that your ISP has elected to discontinue to propogate
postings for those groups.

I've been told that Usenet is an expense that ISPs don't think can be
justified by the their subscribers usage volumes. Since Usenet servers
are peered, ISPs usually have to pay for the priviledge of providing
Usenet, and if volumes are low enough, they elect to discontinue groups
in order to reduce usage fees.

[Tony Lawrence]

Post by Lew Pitcher

Post by unknown
Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.
I suspect that google is causing this ?

I'd suspect that your ISP has elected to discontinue to propogate
postings for those groups.
I've been told that Usenet is an expense that ISPs don't think can be
justified by the their subscribers usage volumes. Since Usenet servers
are peered, ISPs usually have to pay for the priviledge of providing
Usenet, and if volumes are low enough, they elect to discontinue groups
in order to reduce usage fees.

I think it's a trend that will continue (
http://aplawrence.com/Opinion/nntp.html ).

Google makes money from Groups (ad revenue). For other ISP's it's an
expense, and as fewer and fewer people care I think it will
accelerate. I read and post with Google now in spite of its limitations
( http://aplawrence.com/Web/new_groups-beta.html ) and although there
surely will be grumpy holdouts for a long time, I think the future is
pretty easy to see.

[Jim Backus]

Post by Tony Lawrence

Post by Lew Pitcher

Post by unknown
Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.
I suspect that google is causing this ?

I'd suspect that your ISP has elected to discontinue to propogate
postings for those groups.
I've been told that Usenet is an expense that ISPs don't think can be
justified by the their subscribers usage volumes. Since Usenet servers
are peered, ISPs usually have to pay for the priviledge of providing
Usenet, and if volumes are low enough, they elect to discontinue groups
in order to reduce usage fees.

I think it's a trend that will continue (
http://aplawrence.com/Opinion/nntp.html ).

Many internet users seem to be totally unaware of usenet and of course
there are many forums that attempt to provide a similar service. IMHO
forums are much less user friendly and it tends to be more difficult
to browse subjects and follow threads on forums. Besides which many
forums offering computer advice require sign up and sometimes request
contrubutions. Long live usenet!

[Unruh]

Post by Jim Backus

Post by Tony Lawrence

Post by Lew Pitcher

Post by unknown
Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.
I suspect that google is causing this ?

I'd suspect that your ISP has elected to discontinue to propogate
postings for those groups.
I've been told that Usenet is an expense that ISPs don't think can be
justified by the their subscribers usage volumes. Since Usenet servers
are peered, ISPs usually have to pay for the priviledge of providing
Usenet, and if volumes are low enough, they elect to discontinue groups
in order to reduce usage fees.

I think it's a trend that will continue (
http://aplawrence.com/Opinion/nntp.html ).

Many internet users seem to be totally unaware of usenet and of course
there are many forums that attempt to provide a similar service. IMHO
forums are much less user friendly and it tends to be more difficult
to browse subjects and follow threads on forums. Besides which many
forums offering computer advice require sign up and sometimes request
contrubutions. Long live usenet!

Yes, and now my university is threatening to drop usenet ( due to lack of
use they say) and telling us we should use other people's servers.

Post by Jim Backus
--
Jim Backus running OS/2 Warp 3 & 4, Debian Linux and Win98SE
bona fide replies to j <dot> backus <the circle thingy> jita <dot>
demon <dot> co <dot> uk

[David L. Johnson]

Post by Unruh

Post by Jim Backus
Long live usenet!

Sorry, but it's not going to happen. usenet is dead; we just don't seem
to know it yet.

Post by Unruh
Yes, and now my university is threatening to drop usenet ( due to lack
of use they say) and telling us we should use other people's servers.

My university killed the usenet feed (which we had apparently been
receiving without paying for it for some years). After a couple weeks of
not being able to get new messages, I complained. I was the only one who
complained...

I don't think the web-based forums are as useful, since you have to go
digging to find one, logging in is a hassle, and they are not as efficient
at sorting out the wheat from the chaff as a good newsreader is. But,
that is where the focus is going, since it's on the Web. Besides, the
server management can control the trolling.

[notbob]

Post by Tony Lawrence
surely will be grumpy holdouts for a long time, I think the future is
pretty easy to see.

As long as there are those willing to pay, there will be a usenet.

nb

[Vilmos Soti]

Post by notbob
As long as there are those willing to pay, there will be a usenet.

The problem is, other than the discussion groups, who will pay
for it? There are the consumers (who ask questions) and the
providers (who provide the answers). The consumers are going to
web forums. They won't bother paying for a service where they will
not get much of an answer. Who else will pay? Those who actually
provide answers? So, if I am one, then I will have to pay so I can
help some people with sometimes really dumb questions? For free?

Unfortunately, I also think that usenet's days are numbered, and
it will also result in a huge fragmentation. I have been reading
usenet for close to a decade, and every once in a while I helped
people. But I won't read a zillion of web forums. My help (and I
suspect I am not alone) will be lost.

The loss of usenet will be a huge loss for many.

Vilmos

[imotgm]

Post by Vilmos Soti

Post by notbob
As long as there are those willing to pay, there will be a usenet.

The problem is, other than the discussion groups, who will pay
for it?

Haven't spent much time in the alt.binaries.* groups have you? With
multi-millions of headers in a single group, (alt.binaries,dvd,
alt.binaries.dvd-r, alt.binaries.multimedia) discussion groups are reduced
to a small fraction of what Usenet has become. Also, don't forget the porn
groups. The pervs alone would pay enough to keep Usenet alive. Worry more
that your favorite NG won't be displaced to free more space for more porn,
where the money is.

[notbob]

Post by imotgm
Haven't spent much time in the alt.binaries.* groups have you? With
multi-millions of headers in a single group, (alt.binaries,dvd,
alt.binaries.dvd-r, alt.binaries.multimedia) discussion groups are reduced
to a small fraction of what Usenet has become. Also, don't forget the porn
groups. The pervs alone would pay enough to keep Usenet alive....

LOL!...

Post by imotgm
Worry more
that your favorite NG won't be displaced to free more space for more porn,
where the money is.

Time will tell. We may see usenet providers tier their service, as
binaries bogart tons of storage. As for a resource, usenet is
invaluable. I find much, if not most, of my technical questions
answered in newsgroups. Even many of the web site searches I get are
just copies of of some nntp exchange. Google's usenet archive is a
killer-app. Usenet is still very active amongst those in the know.

nb

[The Natural Philosopher]

Post by notbob

Post by imotgm
Haven't spent much time in the alt.binaries.* groups have you? With
multi-millions of headers in a single group, (alt.binaries,dvd,
alt.binaries.dvd-r, alt.binaries.multimedia) discussion groups are reduced
to a small fraction of what Usenet has become. Also, don't forget the porn
groups. The pervs alone would pay enough to keep Usenet alive....

LOL!...

Post by imotgm
Worry more
that your favorite NG won't be displaced to free more space for more porn,
where the money is.

Time will tell. We may see usenet providers tier their service, as
binaries bogart tons of storage. As for a resource, usenet is
invaluable. I find much, if not most, of my technical questions
answered in newsgroups. Even many of the web site searches I get are
just copies of of some nntp exchange. Google's usenet archive is a
killer-app. Usenet is still very active amongst those in the know.
nb

I agree. However there is a huge reason to shovel off binaries to one
huge computer somewhere in the world, and leave it off usenet altogether.

Usenet is quick'n'dirty. For serious stuff with pictures i go to web
based BBS systems.

[imotgm]

Post by notbob

Post by imotgm
Haven't spent much time in the alt.binaries.* groups have you? With
multi-millions of headers in a single group, (alt.binaries,dvd,
alt.binaries.dvd-r, alt.binaries.multimedia) discussion groups are reduced
to a small fraction of what Usenet has become. Also, don't forget the porn
groups. The pervs alone would pay enough to keep Usenet alive....

LOL!...

Go ahead and laugh, but pick a perversion, any perversion, it's here on
Usenet. ;)

Post by notbob

Post by imotgm
Worry more
that your favorite NG won't be displaced to free more space for more porn,
where the money is.

Time will tell. We may see usenet providers tier their service, as
binaries bogart tons of storage. As for a resource, usenet is
invaluable. I find much, if not most, of my technical questions
answered in newsgroups. Even many of the web site searches I get are
just copies of some nntp exchange. Google's usenet archive is a
killer-app.

When I started with Linux I had no internet, and no one to ask questions.
A friend tapped me into his dial-up ISP, and opened an account for me as
part of the five allowed "family" logins. Next came deja.com, which became
google groups, and a read only Usenet server. I spent three years lurking
in anything Linux, looking for, and finding, answers to any question I
might have asked, had I posting access. By the time I had full access to
Usenet, my first post was not a question, but an answer to someone else's
question. It's been pretty much that way ever since. I learned Linux from
the archives. I use the NGs now, to give back to the gnubies, what I gained
from all those searches, and hopefully teach them how to do their own
searches. You are definitely preaching to a member of the choir, on this
subject.

Post by notbob
Usenet is still very active amongst those in the know.

And, I might add, those seeking for more to know. ;-)

[General Schvantzkoph]

Post by unknown
Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.
I suspect that google is causing this ?

I've noticed that activity seems to be down in a lot of Linux newsgroups
but the statistics don't seem to bare this out. I'm using
news.individual.net, I'm wondering if they are getting all of the posts.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Post by General Schvantzkoph

Post by unknown
Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.
I suspect that google is causing this ?

I've noticed that activity seems to be down in a lot of Linux newsgroups
but the statistics don't seem to bare this out.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That would be the 'Naked Truth' then? ;-)

Post by General Schvantzkoph
I'm using
news.individual.net, I'm wondering if they are getting all of the posts.

[John Thompson]

["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.misc.]

Post by unknown
Some previously active Groups at my ISP have suddendly
become dormant; eg. comp.lang.pop.
I suspect that google is causing this ?

Why would that be?

I doubt google is killing usenet, but it does make it smell funny.